AI is already an incredible product designer, but human designers remain essential for truly understanding user needs, inventing something new, and having a distinctive point of view.

22:45sounds crazy, but like engineers never thought it would be able to write code the way it is now. Um, so just yeah, thoughts on just how good AI will get. >> Maybe one way to put it is I think it already is an incredible um product designer. [laughter] Um, it it really is actually already great. The cool thing about it though is it's accessible to every single person.

23:06Um, and it's a tool that anybody can use. I do think it's really good. Now, that doesn't necessarily mean that it's like the best visual designer or best at, you know, uh, information hierarchy or or typography or even, you know, user experience and interaction design. It's not necessarily like the best at any of those. It's impossible to predict where things are going. And like I said earlier, like you know, how much has

23:32changed in three years? Of course, they're going to continue to get better. Um, but the way we think about it and and I and I really do believe this is like we're building tools to enable people to be more creative, to be um to to do more, to build more. And so it's it is already a great designer, but you it's at your fingertips to kind of

23:52figure out how to use it and how to get the best out of it. Where do you think human brains will continue to be most valuable as AI gets better at product design specifically? What are kind of like the remaining areas for us to be useful? >> Truly understanding [snorts] what people need. um you know I mean the human uh feedback loop of watching people use something and and

24:19understanding that um the you know inventing something new um I think uh and then of course there's just the pure like human kind of take right like oh somebody made this somebody had a point of view about this um I just think that I do think that will stand out more and more and I think that that's like an important thing for a designer to like really hone is like what is my point of

24:47view? What who am I building this for and why? Um and I don't know I think like as as as AI becomes more and more like better and better for sure there will be an opportunity to always kind of stand out and push how can you push that even further. >> Yeah, that touches on uh a conversation I had with um the PM of codeex. I asked

25:06him just why is AI not good at design? It's actually gotten better since that conversation, which was just like a month or two ago. And and he had a number of reasons for it. One is just like like part of great product design is doing something new. And so if it's trained on all the most interesting websites today, it's just like okay, but that's not what that's not interesting

25:26anymore. And the other point he made is like AI researchers aren't innately great at design and so they may not understand exactly what it takes to train a model to be really good at this. Uh thoughts? What do you think? What do you think it'll take to get AI to be much much better at product design? >> I mean, the new thing is interesting, right? Because I think that